JustHatched 12,103 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Just a quick poll as I have some air races in mind, but I also know most of my air races are a bit more complex than most which requires CP's to be placed in areas where respawning is difficult (don't crash right?). I putting this poll up to see what is preferred, you can't get better keeping them simple is my thoughts, but I also don't want to make something people hate because the respawns are tough. Vote, or post your thoughts Quote The funniest thing about this particular signature is that by the time you realise it doesn't say anything it's to late to stop reading it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggy 2,811 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 Simple course. I'm not the best pilot and will still crash on occasion. So having a race where I can respawn easily and not get frustrated because I'm stuck work the best. Once I master air racing (probably GTA 7) then I don't mind challenging races. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirrel 5,180 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 (edited) I like the air races where you don't have wings and have all 4 wheels on the ground Air races are the weakest part of my game. Simpler the better for myself but I don't play in the NA timezones as often as I used to so my opinion doesn't count too much as we don't have many air races in the EU time zones. In response to the actual poll questions, is it possible to make a technical course with simple respawns? The weaker pilots will get double the punishment if they end up in a spawn crash loop if they are struggling. I know it's a very Darwinian process but can be very frustrating when you're repeatedly hitting a mountain after one mistake in the wrong area. Edited July 27, 2015 by Squirrel_Army Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodge 7,248 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 I chose technical because I like the thrill of high risk flying. I'm not great at it, but when you get it right, it's very rewarding. I like having to knife the plane, or roll into a CP. Its fun. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beez 5,091 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 I voted technical but maybe make them shorter so they are over quicker for folks that don't like air races. I like them and you only get better by challenging yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omarcomin71 3,838 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 I agree with Dodge. The tougher it is the more rewarding it is when you succeed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LN-MLB 2,583 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 I'm definitely one of the worst pilots in the crew. I openly admit it and I honestly don't know if my skills will ever improve. With that said, I don't mind doing air races every now and then, but admit they are not exactly my favorite. I do prefer less complicated courses, and I find re-spawning into trees and mountains to be a bit frustrating. I also prefer CONTACT air races--not because I have agenda to take others out, but because it adds a different, more enjoyable element when you have to slow down and be much more cautious when others are around. I find non-contact to be just a bit too one-sided at times. If you're lucky enough to start at the front and don't crash, the race is often yours provided it is simple and straightforward. Just my opinion, but I definitely prefer somewhat simple (in regards to being able to see and clear CPs), contact, and not too long in regards to overall length. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssracingn2 935 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 In response to the actual poll questions, is it possible to make a technical course with simple respawns? The weaker pilots will get double the punishment if they end up in a spawn crash loop if they are struggling. I know it's a very Darwinian process but can be very frustrating when you're repeatedly hitting a mountain after one mistake in the wrong area. This is spot on. Quote http://www.gta-stats.com/player/image/medium_1.units_0.platI_1.plat_2/custom.stats_races_ratio.stats_dm_ratio.crime_kills_players_headshots.crime_kdr_players.other_vehicles_speed/ssracingn2.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wraignbow 719 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 I like a combination of the two, some simple, some technical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottyB 2,086 Posted July 27, 2015 Share Posted July 27, 2015 I believe you can make course fairly technical while still having a working track. One thing you probably take for granted as a top pilot is that others aren't as good as you. You think, there is no way they will crash or respawn there so it will be fine, but I guarantee some one will and then they will get stuck. Another thing I noticed when testing my first air race was that holding triangle to respawn vs crashing to respawn has different delays in where you start. You don't start perfectly at the CP, but fly a fair bit ahead of it and one of the respawns flies further ahead for some reason, just something to keep in mind while making them. I know that you can't make tracks as technical due to the limitations of the creator and respawns, but in no way should there ever be a respawn trap if someone crashes or gets lost and respawns, otherwise it's a poorly made track and will frustrate more people than will like it. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djw180 6,841 Posted July 28, 2015 Share Posted July 28, 2015 (edited) I know this is kind of sitting on the fence. But I would want to have a reasonably technical course, with all re spawns points working. If both of those are not possible then having all respawn points working takes priority for me, otherwise you can get stuck with absolutely no way of recovering due to one crash. I think it's big weakness with the Rock Star creator that it will let you place a checkpoint where it's is impossible to respawn from. It can happen in land races as well, but obviously air races are far more likely to have this. I have only tried to make one even moderately technical air race so far, and gave up because I could not get the checkpoints right. So I have much admiration for those of you who can make them. Edited July 29, 2015 by djw180 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Protocawl 2,971 Posted July 28, 2015 Share Posted July 28, 2015 In response to the actual poll questions, is it possible to make a technical course with simple respawns? The weaker pilots will get double the punishment if they end up in a spawn crash loop if they are struggling. I know it's a very Darwinian process but can be very frustrating when you're repeatedly hitting a mountain after one mistake in the wrong area. Not even necessarily the weaker pilots - if it's a contact or GTA air race and you get killed at one of those deadly CPs that guide you straight into a pole/tree/mountain/building then anyone could get stuck there for at least a while. I believe you can make course fairly technical while still having a working track. One thing you probably take for granted as a top pilot is that others aren't as good as you. You think, there is no way they will crash or respawn there so it will be fine, but I guarantee some one will and then they will get stuck. I know that you can't make tracks as technical due to the limitations of the creator and respawns, but in no way should there ever be a respawn trap if someone crashes or gets lost and respawns, otherwise it's a poorly made track and will frustrate more people than will like it. I know this is kind of sitting on the fence. But I would want to have a reasonably technical course, with all re spawns points working. If both of those are not possible then having all respawn points working takes priority for me, otherwise you can get stuck with absolutely no way of recovering due to one crash. I think it's big weakness with the Rock Star creator that it will let you place a checkpoint where it's is impossible to respawn from. It can happen in land races as well, but obviously air races are far more likely to have this. My thoughts exactly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidCore89 7,402 Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 (edited) I like both easy and technical, I also like a variety of the lesser used aircraft too. IMO there are too many Hydra, Besra and Lazer races... Show the Mallard, Miljet and Luxor some love please! Spawn points that have obvious hazards need to be properly tested by manually respawning during a solo test, if a player cannot respawn and safely fly towards the next checkpoint then the race doesn't work, it's common sense. Edited July 29, 2015 by DavidCore89 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustHatched 12,103 Posted July 29, 2015 Author Share Posted July 29, 2015 Given what's posted most of my current races are broke then. I get what is said, and I will try to find a balance, though going up a mountain side without hugging the dirt kind of defeats the goal of the race because respawn will always have you flying straight into it. Quote The funniest thing about this particular signature is that by the time you realise it doesn't say anything it's to late to stop reading it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidCore89 7,402 Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Given what's posted most of my current races are broke then. I get what is said, and I will try to find a balance, though going up a mountain side without hugging the dirt kind of defeats the goal of the race because respawn will always have you flying straight into it. Honestly, I didn't direct that comment at anyone otherwise I'd have listed names and jobs, in fact I didn't even look who made this topic. As for your air races - I wouldn't say most are broken, but some have issues that you're aware of... Such as the cranes at the docks on one of your races, it's very hard to make it through on the first run, but after a few times running it I have been able to easily complete the race without crashing, but not everyone has done that race a bunch of times and not everyone is comfortable with flying in GTA, if you crash there then it's all over. I'm not the best pilot either, average at best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G37 3,444 Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 Given what's posted most of my current races are broke then. I get what is said, and I will try to find a balance, though going up a mountain side without hugging the dirt kind of defeats the goal of the race because respawn will always have you flying straight into it. As Scotty mentioned, you can still very much DO this. You just need to think about it a bit differently. Instead of a number of Cps dotted along the ground, I think you need to play with the beginning and ending CP. You probably only NEED those two, just like you really only need two on a long straight stretch (distance depending) with no impaired sight lines. Like if you're going up some base of Mt Chilliad, play with the route (vehicle depending too) so there's ample momentum before you flick upward and that the slope is bearable enough for whatever aircraft you're using. Obviously the Mallard might need less of a steep slope so it can travel up the length of the base (that's what she said) as opposed to the Besra that is completely self propelled. So I think playing with the approach depending on the vehicle and where that CP is could elevate a good bunch of problems. This also let's the pilot play with their own altitude a bit as well. The downside of course may be that you'll have to refer to your mini-map a bit more. IMO the idea of "make this or be trapped" is sort of unfair. It's similar to those "training facility" type deathmatches. We know they're broken and none of us like spawn traps in deathmatches, so that should hold true in races as well. I still think you can make technical races, you just need to make certain adjustments and compromises with how the creator actually functions. Likewise, Scotty mentioned this last night but I'm not sure he posted it here. A very good idea seems to be to actually rotate the respawn so it's 90 degrees or even 180 degrees from where it is now, allowing you to respawn and fly AWAY from the mountain. Downside here too of course is some confusion when you come back. Better than infinitely crashing into the ground I suppose. Quote "If you ride like lightning, you're gonna crash like thunder." - The Place Between The Pines Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustHatched 12,103 Posted July 29, 2015 Author Share Posted July 29, 2015 Honestly, I didn't direct that comment at anyone otherwise I'd have listed names and jobs, in fact I didn't even look who made this topic. As for your air races - I wouldn't say most are broken, but some have issues that you're aware of... Such as the cranes at the docks on one of your races, it's very hard to make it through on the first run, but after a few times running it I have been able to easily complete the race without crashing, but not everyone has done that race a bunch of times and not everyone is comfortable with flying in GTA, if you crash there then it's all over. I'm not the best pilot either, average at best. I didn't figure you were directing at me or my current races, and even if you were I am not offended in any way. I know some of my races are difficult for even moderate pilots, biggest thing I am hoping to get out of the topic is going forward I plan on making more races but I also want them to be used when possible without everyone cringing at the thought of it or going to sleep from boredom of turning laps Quote The funniest thing about this particular signature is that by the time you realise it doesn't say anything it's to late to stop reading it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidCore89 7,402 Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 I didn't figure you were directing at me or my current races, and even if you were I am not offended in any way. I know some of my races are difficult for even moderate pilots, biggest thing I am hoping to get out of the topic is going forward I plan on making more races but I also want them to be used when possible without everyone cringing at the thought of it or going to sleep from boredom of turning laps I totally understand that there has to be a good balance, I think you've found it so far by mixing different route style and different planes, just a few CP's could be moved if a fix isn't possible (only if that doesn't undermine your race). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kudisanga 380 Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 a balance between technical and easy race are the way are the way forward to me. i done a few very hard races were the spawns sometimes very difficult which make annoying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beez 5,091 Posted July 29, 2015 Share Posted July 29, 2015 I like G's suggestion of a checkpoint at the bottom and one at the top. It's the solution I came up with in my head as well. Yes, pilots will have to use the mini map but pilots IRL must use additional instruments too. I do like the idea of flying low up a mountain side but I've also experienced the frustration of respawning at a checkpoint I couldn't fly away from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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